In March, Mishmumkin raised an issue of great significance to those of us who are looking for that dream TEFL job or are considering starting out in the profession: ‘If I’ve done my research correctly I should know a great deal about my potential employer before the interview. I’m curious what those who do the hiring wish their candidates asked about.’

So, what are recruiters expecting from their prospective employees at the interview? The forum members shared their wealth of experience in offering the following words of great wisdom. Here’s what those in the position to hire feel you should be asking your future employer at that interview:

Ask what you NEED to know

First and foremost, there is a consensus that you really need to ask what’s important to you as the employee: don’t assume that the person interviewing you knows what your priorities are. MELEE notes that, ‘mostly I’m just listening to see what they ask me. That will tell me what’s important to them (the students, the curriculum, resources, housing, benefits, vacation time, etc.). I do the interviews individually, but then report back to a panel – that conversation always includes letting the others know what questions were asked by the candidate.’ When applying for a job it’s easy to forget that, while it’s a one of event for you as the potential employee, the person doing the hiring is having the same interaction many, many times and, as noted earlier, is probably under time constraints. Therefore they are likely to try to get what they need from the encounter, leaving you to ask the questions you personally need answering. Justin Trullinger exemplifies the kind of things that he, from experience, feels teachers should ask at the interview:

‘I do the hiring at the organisation where I work. It’s not that I have a list of questions I want you to ask, because I don’t know what’s important to you but I feel very strongly that you SHOULD ask about whatever is. Some of the worst problems I’ve had with teachers have had to do with things that were important to them that they didn’t find out about beforehand, or didn’t ask for more details.’

Some examples:

1 Clothing:

Teachers placed in elementary schools through us wear uniforms. They are told about this before hiring, and asked if they are okay with it. Depending on the school, these uniforms vary – some are very smart suit looking things, but some, especially at lower income schools, are sweatsuits with school logos. One teacher, very appearance conscious, was so horrified by wearing a sweatsuit that she was unable to continue, and we had to negotiate special permission for her to wear her own clothes. This made all the parents think she was the principal. It was a mess. Personally, I don’t care what I wear, and would love to have a uniform, any uniform that meant I wouldn’t have to shop for clothes, or try to figure out what color tie goes with things…but to her, it was an issue. She should have asked.

2 Costs of living:

Some things are very cheap in Ecuador. Some are more expensive. Computers are first world prices or higher. Having read online that the cost of living in Ecuador is low (in terms of rent and food, it is) one teacher decided rather than bringing a computer, to buy one here. But here, lap tops are high end luxury without much selection. He should have asked.

3 Housing:

We don’t provide housing – but many of our teachers share apartments with each other – which is clearly stated in our pre-interview literature. This is because Ecuadorian apartments are mostly large family or multifamily units, and it would be hard to afford one on your own. A teacher who doesn’t like to share simply assumed that he could find his own, and anticipated finding an apartment for the same cost as a room in a shared unit. Not a chance. Then he complains that it’s hard to make ends meet…should have asked.

4 Teaching conditions:

Our teachers are expected to use text books, but not to spend the whole course using only textbooks. They also have to be creative and come up with their own supplementary activities and materials. Payment for this is included in their hourly rate – they are not paid for extra hours for doing it. This is standard enough that I didn’t make an issue of it, though again, it says in the package that “teaching hours are paid for at $X per hour, and that this rate includes preparation…” Again, if this is a problem, ask, let’s talk beforehand. Likewise, if you have any financial obligations outside of the country, like student loan payments, it would be good to ask about how feasible that is…

To that list I’d certainly want to add medical insurance and, if you’re thinking about staying in a country for an extended period of time, you might also want to look into their policies regarding work permits and social security contributions. Those of you who’re new to teaching may find it hard to believe but some of us end up staying for good. It would be a shame to find out several years down the line that you’ve been living illegally and that you’re presence in a country is no longer welcome, or that what could have become a reasonable state pension to supplement your retirement doesn’t exist as your employers never registered you. Ask!

Post-interview questions

Of course, sometimes as the interviewee, you’re going to feel overwhelmed by the situation. A natural consequence of this is forgetting to ask the questions that you really need answering, as Emma notes, ‘I’ve found in interviews that the interviewer has told me so much information about the school and teaching methods that I really can’t think of anything when asked if I have questions. To ask about obvious stuff like salary when I haven’t been offered a job seems presumptuous.’ This issue of asking about salary is something that I’ll return to later. Emma also asked the following question on the forum:

‘How do you feel about teachers coming back and asking questions before accepting the post?’

MELEE replied thus, reiterating the need to be time conscious, ‘I think it’s great. I’d rather teachers ask only 2 or 3 of the most important questions in the interview, but that’s because we interview over the phone and I’m under pressure to try to keep the calls around 30 minutes. I welcome additional questions by email, no matter how many. The sooner the better because really I’m using those questions to decide whether or not I’m going to make you an offer.’ Something I’ve always done at the end of an interview is ask the interviewer if I can make additional contact after our meeting, primarily because I experience the kind of information overload that Emma mentions. As MELEE quite clearly states, this is beneficial to both parties.

Time (not) to talk money

Now onto the issue that’s almost always at the bottom line, salary. Gordon shares his thoughts on the matter:

‘Prospective applicants should not ask about salary until they are offered the job. On the other hand, applicants should have a pretty good idea of the salary at this point anyways. I won’t apply for a job unless I have a decent idea of the salary range, in many cases it would be a waste of everyone’s time. I hate it when jobs don’t give the salary in the ad or at least the salary range.’ It’s not impossible these days to get a fairly good idea of what you can expect to earn in a particular country or even at a certain school. Asking questions at the ELT World Forums is one good way to learn such information. Sherri adds, ‘I don’t see why the salary should be such a big secret. I always tell the applicants what they can expect to make. I usually tell them over the phone before we schedule the interview. There is a pay scale so it is easy to figure out. All teachers have a copy of the pay scale once hired. If it looks like the interview is going well, I tell them how often they will be paid and when they can expect their first pay check. This is especially important for people who are relocating for a job.’ I also chipped in with a recommendation which has always seen me right in the past:

‘I think it’s appropriate for the interviewee to raise the issue, such as, ‘I’m sure once you’ve made your decision about hiring me, we can talk in more detail about the salary and benefits package you offer.’ This lets the interviewer know that while this isn’t your only motivation for wanting the job, it is something that they expect to be informed about in detail at some point.’

Gordon summarises the issue perfectly when he states, ‘I think one doesn’t want to appear as though money is the most important factor in the job decision, whereas we all know that it is.’ I would make it clear that you will want to have a clear idea about the kind of money you’ll be earning without making that the sole purpose for you having turned up for the interview.

How can you prepare for the interview?

What can you do before the interview? Gordon again offers advice:

‘Before an interview, I write a list of things (housing, resources, etc) that I want answered before deciding to take a job. Then, during the interview I take copious notes, and if the interview hasn’t answered my questions, I ask them at the question time. Although, just thinking about it now, I haven’t had a face to face interview for years now, so its easy to have my little list and notebook. Not sure how that would go down in a face to face interview.’

While Gordon may not have tried this in a face to face interview, this is a tactic that I myself have used and find that it has been received well. If you’ve taken the time to sit down and make a note of what you need to know from this potential employer, it gives the impression that you’re serious about wanting the job.

Another thing that makes a good impression is showing that you’ve given some thought about how you’ll fit in to the school. Sherri exemplifies, ‘I must admit, I like it when people ask about the students. I like it when they ask about the work atmosphere, but how the teachers work together, if they share and support each other. I like it if they show an interest in our program and show that they at least looked at our website.’ For the interview I had for my present job, I printed off the school’s entire website, annotated the points that interested me and highlighted other information I wanted to ask about. While there was no way for me to get through more than one or two points that I’d noted, it gave the impression that I’d really thought about why I wanted to work here, and was told as much later.

Don’t waste their time

Let’s now briefly assume you’ve been offered a job. Having noted earlier that recruiters appreciate you asking questions that will help you decide if you’re going to take the position, think about whether or not you’re realistically thinking of taking the position before making secondary contact. MELEE explains: ‘If I make the offer, then you hit me with questions that lead me to believe that this is not the best position for you, then you’ve wasted my time because I need to give you adequate time before I offer it to someone else rather than you.’ Think, at some point it could be you who misses out on an interview because someone was wasting the recruiter’s time mulling over an offer they didn’t intend to take.

One thing you also really need to do is prioritise what you need to ask. The interviewer will want to make a decision about you just as much as you want to decide if you want the job. One sure way to put off the person deciding whether or not to hire you will be asking questions to which you could easily find the answers elsewhere. Think about this: what would you rather know about, the number of hours you could expect to work in an average week or the colour of the tiles in the bathroom of the apartment you’ll be sharing? Prioritise what you need to learn about the school. Yaramaz explains this issue, referring to a recent incident in her efforts to recruit teachers:

‘We just recently recruiting for next term and have had an interesting time poring over applications. One woman included a jpeg list of over 100 questions for us to answer– not even in word or PDF format! How can we even begin to answer 147 questions on a jpeg??? And most were really pointless questions that could be googled or asked in the interview, like “Do you have a photocopier?’ and ‘what is the climate of your city?’ Aaaaagh!’

Aaaaaagh indeed. Imagine how you would feel if you received such a list of questions at a time when you’ve got to interview numerous people. How much priority would you give to someone who asked questions to which they could so easily find the answers themselves? I’ll conclude by returning to the advice of Justin Trullinger: ‘It isn’t a question of what you should ask – but ask everything that YOU need to know. I may not know what’s important to you, but it’s important that you ask about what you need to know. Do not assume! Whatever you need to know in order to make an adequate decision, you’ll need to ask.’

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What were your initial aims when setting up ELT Notebook?

I’d been involved in teacher training for about thirty years (eeek!) and as I never throw anything away, had an enormous amount of material on file. It seemed sensible to put it on-line in order to make it available to other people – and so that I could get rid of some files and make space in my very overcrowded office!

How would you rate the health of the ELT profession in general?

Mixed. Without going into whether or not globalisation is a good thing, it is happening and at the moment means that English is growing exponentially in importance. That means there’s a lot of opportunity, and there are also some really good organisations doing quality work. However, there are also a lot of cowboys who are exploiting both their students and their staff. Sadly, ELT is often still not a profession at all – there are still organisations who convince their customers that as long as the teacher is a native speaker that’s all that’s necessary. And there are even more schools that see an initial qualification like the CELTA as the finishing point in the teacher’s development rather than just the start. Unfortunately, these organisations damage the profession as a whole. If school X employs non-qualified teachers who are paid a pittance, their prices will inevitably undercut those of the professional organisations like school Y who ask for a CELTA and pay more for a DELTA, an MA, and experience. So school Y either goes out of business or ends up paying their qualified teachers a pittance too.

How important do you see sites such as the Rat Race Rebellion, for which you’re a contributing expert?

R3 excited me from the moment Mike Haaren, one of the site’s founders, first contacted me. The site aims to help people take control of their lives by allowing them to control when, where and how they work. I gave up working for other organisations in 1989, and you’d have to pay me an awful lot more money than is usually found in ELT to make me go back. Don’t get me wrong – I worked for some great organisations, was never exploited, and would never have learnt what I did if I’d gone freelance earlier. I’m very, very grateful to all of the colleagues and bosses who I worked with. If I worked 60 hour weeks and ended up with burn-out it was my choice, never imposed. But there came a point when I’d had enough of achieving other people’s objectives. I wanted to achieve my own – and that meant leaving time for things which weren’t EFL related as well as those which were. And that’s where R3 comes in. Their philosophy is that work is important – you should, as they say, be able to lock the office door. But there has to be time for other things too. Not only from a personal point of view, but also because of the impact on families, the environment and society in general. The aim of the site is to provide people with the information and tools to make this possible.

What do you feel have been the major changes in the profession of the course of your years working in ELT?

There have been many. When I took the DTEFLA exam (the precursor of both CELTA and DELTA) we were still in the era of audiolingual methodology. The very last session on the course – you know, the one that is thrown in last because it has no relevance to the exam – was on communicative methodology, which was just starting to emerge. I can still remember it – it was given by Robert O’Neill and was a breath of fresh air. Over the next few years I was privileged to work with and study under people at the cutting edge of the communicative revolution – Alan Maley, Keith Johnson and Keith Morrow, Gill Sturtridge and David Wilkins – and it was probably the most exciting time of my career.

Then there is the way that technology has changed language teaching. When I started, I didn’t even have a tape recorder in the classroom!

What would you like to see happen in the world of ELT?

Three things :

a.. Following on from my answer to question 2, the thing that I would most like to see happen would be for ELT to become a recognised profession, with a clear career progression where qualifications and experience were both essential and well-remunerated, and the cowboys were excluded.

b.. Similarly, I would like to see on-line teaching, which I think is the format of the future, become more professional and more regulated.

c.. Finally, I would like to see a move away from the idea that native speakers are the only valid ELT professionals. Many non-native speakers are far better teachers, and have far more idea of students’ problems, than the average native-speaker teacher. Teachers should be assessed on overall professional competence, not just on their first language.

My thanks to Sue for taking the time to answer these questions. Please take a look at the excellent ELT Notebook, as well as Rat Race Rebellion. Sue is currently working on putting courses on-line for the new format Cambridge ESOL DELTA course modules at the DELTA Course blog.

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What were your initial aims when setting up ELT Notebook?

I’d been involved in teacher training for about thirty years (eeek!) and as I never throw anything away, had an enormous amount of material on file. It seemed sensible to put it on-line in order to make it available to other people – and so that I could get rid of some files and make space in my very overcrowded office!

How would you rate the health of the ELT profession in general?

Mixed. Without going into whether or not globalisation is a good thing, it is happening and at the moment means that English is growing exponentially in importance. That means there’s a lot of opportunity, and there are also some really good organisations doing quality work. However, there are also a lot of cowboys who are exploiting both their students and their staff. Sadly, ELT is often still not a profession at all – there are still organisations who convince their customers that as long as the teacher is a native speaker that’s all that’s necessary. And there are even more schools that see an initial qualification like the CELTA as the finishing point in the teacher’s development rather than just the start. Unfortunately, these organisations damage the profession as a whole. If school X employs non-qualified teachers who are paid a pittance, their prices will inevitably undercut those of the professional organisations like school Y who ask for a CELTA and pay more for a DELTA, an MA, and experience. So school Y either goes out of business or ends up paying their qualified teachers a pittance too.

How important do you see sites such as the Rat Race Rebellion, for which you’re a contributing expert?

R3 excited me from the moment Mike Haaren, one of the site’s founders, first contacted me. The site aims to help people take control of their lives by allowing them to control when, where and how they work. I gave up working for other organisations in 1989, and you’d have to pay me an awful lot more money than is usually found in ELT to make me go back. Don’t get me wrong – I worked for some great organisations, was never exploited, and would never have learnt what I did if I’d gone freelance earlier. I’m very, very grateful to all of the colleagues and bosses who I worked with. If I worked 60 hour weeks and ended up with burn-out it was my choice, never imposed. But there came a point when I’d had enough of achieving other people’s objectives. I wanted to achieve my own – and that meant leaving time for things which weren’t EFL related as well as those which were. And that’s where R3 comes in. Their philosophy is that work is important – you should, as they say, be able to lock the office door. But there has to be time for other things too. Not only from a personal point of view, but also because of the impact on families, the environment and society in general. The aim of the site is to provide people with the information and tools to make this possible.

What do you feel have been the major changes in the profession of the course of your years working in ELT?

There have been many. When I took the DTEFLA exam (the precursor of both CELTA and DELTA) we were still in the era of audiolingual methodology. The very last session on the course – you know, the one that is thrown in last because it has no relevance to the exam – was on communicative methodology, which was just starting to emerge. I can still remember it – it was given by Robert O’Neill and was a breath of fresh air. Over the next few years I was privileged to work with and study under people at the cutting edge of the communicative revolution – Alan Maley, Keith Johnson and Keith Morrow, Gill Sturtridge and David Wilkins – and it was probably the most exciting time of my career.

Then there is the way that technology has changed language teaching. When I started, I didn’t even have a tape recorder in the classroom!

What would you like to see happen in the world of ELT?

Three things :

a.. Following on from my answer to question 2, the thing that I would most like to see happen would be for ELT to become a recognised profession, with a clear career progression where qualifications and experience were both essential and well-remunerated, and the cowboys were excluded.

b.. Similarly, I would like to see on-line teaching, which I think is the format of the future, become more professional and more regulated.

c.. Finally, I would like to see a move away from the idea that native speakers are the only valid ELT professionals. Many non-native speakers are far better teachers, and have far more idea of students’ problems, than the average native-speaker teacher. Teachers should be assessed on overall professional competence, not just on their first language.

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The International Training Institute (ITI) specialises in teacher training and development. They have been conducting teacher training courses since 1988 and boast one of the highest success ratios worldwide. ITI is internationally recognised as a leading centre for the Cambridge CELTA and DELTA courses and is the only approved UCLES centre for both of these courses in Turkey. The institute is run by Tom Godfrey, who, along with Sally Hirst and Brigid Nugent, was kind enough to answer several questions about teacher training in the early twenty-first century. Here’s part one of the interview:

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What Would Motivate you to Take a New Job?
by members of the forum (general discussion)

Interview:
Teacher Reflections, Global Connections

Teaching Collocations
by Adam Simpson

The EnglishUK Teachers Conference
by Paul Gallantry

Academicus Electronicus
by Brandreth McClure

Was your Initial Training Course Worth it?
by members of the forum (general discussion)

The Ideal English Teacher through the Eyes of ELT Trainees
by Sandra Bayona & Adriana Wiegand

Teaching English in New Zealand
by Martin McMorrow

Interview:
The Latin America Job list and TEFL Tips

Remember: issue 1 and issue 2 are still available, totally free, for your reading pleasure.

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Why did you set up your sites?

I wanted to create a place where people could get information about teaching in Latin American, living in Peru, and hints to help teachers. I have three sites; two are about teaching and one about Peru.

Firstly, there’s the the LA Job List where in addition to giving information about teaching in Latin America, such as visas, how to find a job, etc. I have job lists for 19 Latin American countries.

TEFL Tips gives tips for teaching, such as Teaching English, Teaching Large Classes, Living in a Foreign Country, etc.

Finally, the Ultimate Peru List is a site which has information about life in Peru from working, immigrations, settling down, etc.

I have been gathering information on these topics on years and constantly update in order for people to have the latest information.

Why did you feel the need to start your teaching sites?

I feel that I have a bit of experience in teaching and living in Peru. For example, when I come to Peru I knew nothing, there was hardly any info on the web, so I had to struggle with things myself. I believe that now since I have more experience in teaching and Peru that I should share the info with other people. It makes the transition so much easier.

I suppose after you spend years posting in forums, people tend to know who you are and approach you for advice. I originally started posting information on forums due to the fact that people would email and PM (private message) me with the same questions. I thought posting the information would make it readily available to everyone. People’s questions were the motivation behind me creating the information that I have.

I only recently started the websites. I’m involved in several forums both about TEFL and Peru and had the information on those forums, I try to update as often as possible and it just became too difficult to update them all. I thought that instead of updating all the forums, I could just put the links in my signature and people could easily find the information on my website.

What’s your background in teaching?

During university I got the chance to do some short-term teaching in China, Taiwan and Venezuela. Once I graduated I knew that it was what I wanted to do. I’ve been teaching for five years. I did my TEFL Diploma with the Boland School in the Czech Republic in January 2003. Then I went to teach for them in Suzhou, China, later I went to a kindergarten in Changchun, China. In August 2004, I moved to Lima, Peru to teach at a university and had the intention to stay a year, but ended up getting married a year later. In August 2006, we moved to Lima where I taught at a university and secondary school. In November 2007 I made the decision to come to Korea to work at a primary school in order to do my thesis, but will be going home to Lima at the end of January 2008.

I think that it’s important to keep learning about teaching, so I try to attend conferences and workshops every couple of months. I also have presented in some of them. My background isn’t in teaching, so I started my MA in TEFL in February 2006 in order to learn more about it.

What are your favorite teaching sites?

I like ELT World (www.elt-world.blogspot.com) because it’s a breath of fresh air in the TEFL World. The forums are mostly made up of TEFL oldbies who know each other so the atmosphere is very friendly. TEFL Watch (www.teflwatch.org) is also very useful for finding info about good and bad schools.

As for teaching material, I think that good sites are One Stop English (www.onestopenglish.com), Boggle’s World (www.bogglesworld.com), also the Mark’s English site (www.mes-english.com) as well as ESL Galaxy (www.esl-galaxy.com).

What do you think is the biggest challenge facing TEFL teachers today?

I think it’s to overcome the stereotypes. Unfortunately, some people still think of EFL teachers as backpackers who are only in it to see the world, but more and more we’re seeing people who are making a career out of teaching. Seeing people serious about teaching is good for the students and employers.

What’s your most positive teaching experience?

I like playing games in class, so anytime I see students laughing and having fun while in class is wonderful for me. I like teaching children, so it’s fun to see them cock their head to one side and think how to say things in English and then they get a kick out of it when they can communicate with the teacher.

What are your future plans for your various websites?

I’ve had so much feedback about my sites and people have contacted me giving me heaps of suggestions about what to do, which I really appreciate.

For The LA Job List, I would like to have people add their stories about teaching in specific countries, so that people who want to teach in those countries can know what to expect as far as salary, numbers of hours, etc.

For TEFL Tips, I would like to continue adding more tips for specific teaching situations, such as teaching children, teaching business English, etc. I also hope to have people add their tips as well.

For The Ultimate Peru List, I have 50 Word pages of information and would like to work on the organisation so that people can easily find the info they’re looking for.

One thing that I think is important is giving people credit for what they’ve done. So many people have approached me and asked to help me out. I have a Credits section on The LA Job List where I list people who have helped me out with large portions of the website. When people give me small tips I always put their name next to it. Or if they add my website to theirs I do the same. I think it’s important for people to realise “what goes around, comes around.”

Visit the the LA Joblist, the Ultimate Peru List and TEFL tips websites:

http://www.thelajoblist.blogspot.com/

http://www.tefltips.blogspot.com/

http://www.theultimateperulist.blogspot.com

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The site itself is a pretty useful resource, with information for those thinking about TEFL, as well as the following regular columns:

Destination TEFL

TEFLers around the World

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